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/hi/ - History and Culture
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There's a new /777/ up, it's /selfhelp/ - You're Pathetic, We're Pathetic, We Can Do This! Check it out. Suggest new /777/s here.

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Celsius ## Admin ## 09/12/28(Mon)07:43 No. 1 [Reply] Locked Stickied

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Now that this is a real board, it's time to lay down some rules:

1. Don't be a faggot

Thank you, and enjoy

Orlando Figes - Crimean War Historian 14/11/04(Tue)20:33 No. 14455 [Reply]

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I want a good overview book of the Crimean War but it doesn't really seem like there is a canon account of this historical period. Figes has written one, but he's a rather modern historian. All the published histories of the Crimean War seem pretty modern.

What do you think of Orlando Figes? Is he a solid, dependable writer? Do you think that he would show a pro-British bias in this book?

Historian 14/12/20(Sat)10:31 No. 14491

Google Karamzin.

Historian 14/12/21(Sun)08:52 No. 14493

Can confirm, Karamzin is awesome.

Historian 12/06/07(Thu)01:08 No. 12470 [Reply] [Last 50 posts]

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So is the Islamic invasion of Europe an intentional act being perpetrated by a multitude of interest groups in the Arab world.

Or they are invading Europe because the laws are so lax, Africans are too poor to do so, and Asiatics are in their own realm.

The dude in germany getting beat up by turkish immigrants for wearing a german immigrants got me thinking. Plus this issue started late 90s and just seems to be rolling out of control.

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Historian 14/12/18(Thu)02:55 No. 14487

The US sports franchises are certainly better at covering up incidents. You have to dig through police blotters to even find mention of all the arrests that happen before, during, and after games.

Even when groups of fans charge onto the field nobody ends up up seeing it on camera thanks to time delays and editing. There's the occasional oddly-timed commercial break to cover up large incidents, while for small ones - that don't spread beyond the stands - the cameras just don't show the sections affected until after the fans get cleared out (there's never a shortage of fans milling around outside to take their seats).

The only time you hear about incidents is when the riots spill out of the stadium and into surrounding areas, with widespread looting, arson, and other serious crimes. Those are fairly rare but that doesn't mean that everything's just sunshine and rainbows in-between the crime sprees. There's a reason stadiums are never put into the wealthy parts of town...

Historian 14/12/20(Sat)09:45 No. 14490


While Marx advocated open borders, I doubt he expected the type of mass immigration of Turks/islabomb refugees expecting western social welfare state handouts, that then repay the EU with 17 kids and acid attacks and shariah law protests we see today

Historian 14/12/21(Sun)07:46 No. 14492

I think, the thing is, if we from the outset just said, "WOAH", or "WOAH + GTFO", then we'd have every other nation on earf and the UN and every islamic wacko in the world saying we're the new Nazi's and how dare we discriminate and oppress well-meaning religious people and blah blah blah. But if we say, "ok, fine, come on in." and then they fucking flood in and wreck the place up and start chopping heads off, well then we can respond with "WOAH + GTFO + TRAINCARS + FIRE THE OVENS" or whatever we need to.

What I'm saying is, we can't just open with that. We need to give Muslims enough rope to hang themselves with, which we've done, and they seem to be getting quite comfortable with putting around their necks.

So I think it's going quite well, in fact. The worse it gets, the better off we'll be for it when push comes to shove.

Historian 14/11/11(Tue)09:03 No. 14463 [Reply]

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Rough idea just coming together here, but at least half the people who live in the USA want to live in another USA. ...a USA without most of the US government. ...if the Native American reservation lands are technically Sovereign Nations unto themselves, but reside within the borders of the US... they get the security of the USA by default, but...

and they were to say "heyyy, huge corporate & biotech & energy companies, all the shit the squeamish US Gov doesn't want you to do, Stem Cell research, Cloning, Liquid Flouride Thorium Reactor, etc... We're gonna designate this area over here, where you can do it all, & if your corporate headquarters & employees want to relocate here, we're simply going to extend everyone a 4% flat tax to you and your employees, and you can tell the US Gov and the IRS and SEC and their costly bureaucracy to go get stuffed.

The US Government would be woefully unable to compete with what a Tribe could offer. Those lands would quickly become the most valuable lands in the world, still owned by the tribes, because of the legal protections the tribes provide, and even on such a looow tax rate, those tribes would ensure the companies remain happy, and grow wealthy enough to not need the unreliable pittance from the US Gov, begin to acquire more of their own lands back, and finally prosper as the cool landlords of the worlds most desirable, powerful nations, probably the best role anyone could ever hope for, could stop relying on & self destructing from the casino racket, could afford to develop modern cities reflecting their own culture (instead of all the displaced european replica cities we're used to), the world would get the science it wants, etc etc etc.

If we willed our lands to Native Tribes, we'd be willing it away from the shitty US Government...

...I can't believe I'm thinking what the native americans need are giant corporations, but fuck there's a way to build an alternate USA.

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Historian 14/11/29(Sat)17:20 No. 14470

thats basicly how many tribes open up casinos and sell cheap ciggarettes.

How much of that they want on their land is their business though.

You simply cannot "will your land" to another sovereign entity, tribe or nation. You only own your land under the government. This is how it works, this is how it's always worked.

Private property exists at the will of either a government or at gunpoint.(which is also gunpoint). Think thats a joke? If you "own" land, it basicly means you have a piece of paper given to you by the government allowing you to "own" it. If the government didn't exist, your neighbors would most likely respect your claim, so long as you lived there, or where using the land, but after a certain peroid of time(like 100 years), people would forget you where there and just move in.

Property rights be damned, if the US government didn't want you doing something, they'd stop you. Anywhere in the world, if it became enough trouble to be worth the while.

Historian 14/12/19(Fri)07:09 No. 14488


that's why you give them thousands and millions of little targets that have ties with millions and billions who wouldn't approve of or appreciate the US regime entity's bad behaviour towards those initial few thousands and millions who agitate against the US government, effectively backing the government into a corner to acquiesce to your will, overwhelmed by too many little targets, each of which can be a threat to the individuals that make up the government, but none of which are so easily distinguished from the rest of the population, which would overwhelm the regime's personnel should it ever come out that they're dangerous to the whole of population

Historian 14/12/19(Fri)07:11 No. 14489


actually the danger can be imagined as well, a key tactic is to provoke bad behaviour by relying on the regime's laziness and hubris, this is a good tactic since it's got a good chance of working against bad regimes, and simply doesn't if a regime is half decent

the fallout leads to recruitment for one's own side and if it continues on long enough becomes a critical mass chain reaction, a half decent regime is like a reactor with cooling rods

Hitler did nothing wrong? Historian 14/11/08(Sat)06:59 No. 14456 [Reply]

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My purpose in posting this is not to incite a drama filled thread - what I'm looking for are people who can confidently denounce the claim that the Holocaust did not happen.

It's political suicide to see Hitler and the Nazi party as anything but evil, so I'm hoping someone can help out.
Embedded is a youtube link to a 6:30 hour long documentary entitled 'Hitler: the Greatest Story Never Told'. It's banned in a substantial number of countries, so VPNs at the ready if you want to watch it.
It lists many atrocities committed by allies during WWII, the ethnic cleansing of the German people following it, and shows research into the 'death camps' that Soviets liberated, this and more suggests the Holocaust story was a fabrication by the allied powers to support the existence of the state of Israel and justify WWII itself. My problem is that is rings of truth. After a read through of anti-denialist material I'm not happy that this event occurred as claimed in our popular history.

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Historian 14/12/08(Mon)21:16 No. 14481

It should be obvious to anyone but the most delusional quack that the holocaust happened on some level. Even the Naz themselves kept records of the entire development, from their increasingly desperate birth-defect measures to mental patients to euthanasia to incinerators to war to work camps to POW's, etc. All well justified at the time and thoroughly internally documented.

However, none of the numbers of dead add up properly, and once you see the history behind these numbers, it creates a very real sliver of doubt. As well, England took Germanys own propaganda efforts and ran with them for their own purposes, as well as turning the apathetic public opinion in the US to their advantage. This is also well documented and unfortunately casts a reasonable pall of suspicion over all the media on both sides of that time. Then, there seems to be far, faaar greater reverence paid to the relatively fewer Jews that died than all the tens of millions of others that were killed in that conflict, which creates an aire of resentment toward them, notably the Slavs and Russians. Absent are the stories of the many, many millions of Germans who were not on board whatsoever with the crazymaking and at the greatest risk of all, actually resisted from inside and lost, including most of my family and most of their friends and neighbors. Not a fucking peep about them. Just Jews Jews Jews, all day every day. Not Poland being stomped into the ground with a fresh German Military, or France suffering the same, after having just previously inviting loads of german farmers to settle on their borders, who simply let the german army waltz right in and mow everyone down, not the firebombing of london or berlin, or the insanity of nuking two enormous densely populated cities... no, that's all cool.

What do you need to know about WWII kids? Hitler persecuted the Jews, and now, everyone owes them everything, forever. Class dismissed!

See how that might lead to suspicion and resentment?

How far people choose to run with their disgust is entirely subjective, but the whole thing is seriously a mess. Most historians with any ethics shift uncomfortably and avoid citing any numbers in that war because to willfully choose a number when you know you don't have real numbers and never will, and there's no way to know the real numbers even if they were staring you in the face, is to knowingly misrepresent the actual lives ruined and the entire nature of the conflict itself.

The "holo" in the word "Holocaust" implies a die-off of humans, and should not be reserved for a single event, and certainly not a single subset of people in a single event. If there were a die-off in human history worthy of the term "holocaust", it should be Genghis Kahns reign, still the greatest slaughte Message too long. Click here to view the full text.

Historian 14/12/11(Thu)04:57 No. 14483

go home sargon you're drunk

Historian 14/12/16(Tue)11:42 No. 14485

I urge you to take a look at the list of sources that documentary provides. It's a bit disturbing when a documentary purporting to have the truth, despite having access to a dearth of German primary documents capture after the war, barely references any of them, choosing rather to reference mostly websites and hardly a book.

I recommend you read Shirer's The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich for a well researched account of the war.

Historian 12/08/09(Thu)21:35 No. 12933 [Reply]

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Why are Confucian societies so non-religious nowadays? At first, I guessed communism, but it turns out that Nice Korea and Japan are also pretty non-religious. They constantly rank low in religiosity polls, and are among the few societies where it isn't correlated with wealth.

(Confucian sphere is more or less China, Japan, Korea and Vietnam).

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Historian 14/11/29(Sat)17:33 No. 14472


yeah, I fucking hate when people mix up democratic-republicans and federalists.

federalism is the exact reason the US is what it is today.

Historian 14/12/10(Wed)22:08 No. 14482

Confucianism is Old Crank conservatism, part of which was deemed useful as tool in establishing a sense of cultural identity. It was still useful in this regard, after the communist revolution showed everyone how destructive religion had been to them over the ages and how it was holding them back and keeping them in intellectual and economic poverty.

...and by showed, I mean grabbed them by their faces, tied them down to a fucking electric chair, pried their eyelids open clockwork-orange style, beat them with spiked clubs for a while, lit their shoes on fire, and blasted the images into their eyeballs with a million candle-power projector, then went out and smashed and burned and blasted with cannons their entire goddamn history so there would be no turning back. They meant to leave an irreversible lasting impression, and they did.

It's unfortunate for the human species that lasting progress tends to come at the hands of violent authoritarians in these horrible bloody losses of culture and life, but it's a fairly common theme throughout history. Some heavy-handed asshole comes to power with a grand vision, realizes there's no way to implement it without slaughtering everyone not on board, does so, and then what remains of the culture, bloodied and dazed, makes a little lurch forward an inch or two. It's monstrously horrible, but it's also why most humans have developed from living short miserable lives to thriving in unprecedented ease and comfort. The ends don't justify the means to the people and cultures that paid the cost, but since there's no changing the fact that it happened, they paid it, we have nothing to do but accept history and keep the best aspects of the ends that those means bought.

Unfortunately, I think that's the best that progress and human civilization can say for itself, which isn't much. That's why I get high instead of contributing to it.

Historian 14/12/11(Thu)04:58 No. 14484

confucianism reminds me of plato and cliven bundy in a vague chinese aesthetic kind of way

Historian 14/01/05(Sun)14:13 No. 14095 [Reply]

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umm... holy shit?


tell me this isn't real? anyways, herut merged into likud in 1988 apparently, about 25-26 years ago, likud being the current reigning party under netenyahu

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Historian 14/10/16(Thu)13:40 No. 14449


oh I actually like it, I'll check out "ideas and opinions" sometime, I mostly checked out quotes in wikiquote and other quote sites a couple years ago on various characters/people/figures/whatever, so I'm half-confident I've got the right impression but I'm definitely interested in getting it right

anyways, the "tell me this isn't real" thing was actually me saying "pinch me am I dreaming?" I'd been aware of some brutal behaviour by israel to gaza for some time and was happy to finally find some information that puts zionism on the backfoot through appeals to authority, as well as examples of people who didn't hold to it's views that it would claim to represent

Historian 14/11/29(Sat)17:52 No. 14474

yes, ablert einstien was a legimate socialist, mostly pacifist, and dedicated anti-facist.

There is no diffrence between the origins of what is now likud, and litteral facism, this is a fact.

>It is almost certain that the signer was not "the" Albert Einstein.

if it was not, then it echos his known sentiments exactly.

Zionism is litterally Jewish National Socialism, while the left zionism might have been far more on the socialist side, the founders of likud's only critique against actual Fascism was "it was against the jews, otherwise we'd support it",

Einstien was a labor zionist, that broke pretty early against zionism as a whole, for obvious reasons.

Historian 12/01/25(Wed)04:59 No. 11345 [Reply]

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The good guys lost the Napoleonic wars.

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Historian 13/06/17(Mon)10:25 No. 13813

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Napoleons Military Dictatorship >>>>>>>>>>> Austria, Russia and Prussia of the time.

Historian 14/10/15(Wed)09:29 No. 14447

Boring shit.

Historian 14/11/29(Sat)17:42 No. 14473


compared to the revolutionaries he replaced sure, but compared to the whole wad of self described "conservative alliance" against him, he was a liberator.

Napolean is probably the best dictator in history hands down.

viva le revolution

Appreciate Wilem Dafoe Historian 13/08/28(Wed)04:17 No. 13892 [Reply]

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Historically, the best actor ever.

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Historian 14/10/15(Wed)09:10 No. 14446

That was pretty great.

Historian 14/11/09(Sun)06:03 No. 14461

I liked it too. What's with the recurring joke that Dafoe is someone you want to avoid?

Historian 14/11/15(Sat)04:52 No. 14465

no he is not.

Historian 14/04/04(Fri)05:25 No. 14242 [Reply]

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How much money does America and the EU give to second/third world countries to give people jobs in maintaining/developing their forests and such?

Imagine if we gave all our war budget to countries to renovate their shit and regenerate all the things that we are losing

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Historian 14/10/21(Tue)17:40 No. 14450

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I always find it really weird that Americans like JFK so much. What exactly did he do that was so different?

He wasn't interested in social reform - Johnson did that.

He wasn't interested in rational diplomacy, and pushed any aggressive angle he could in foreign policy, including violating missile treaties, which is playing with fire, and pursuing an escalation in the war in Vietnam to defend a nasty like dictatorship in the south.

Also, he was corrupt as hell, and only got into politics because of his family ties, which included a lot of mob money and union bribing, etc.

I may have been swallowing bullshit (its possible) but I haven't heard anything good about him. It seems at least possible that he is only applauded out of the idea that he died tragically young. "Oh, he would have done such great things!" Yeah, like what? We could speculate anything here.

I agree with most of the rest of your post though. Just the JFK bit that got me itchy.

Historian 14/10/23(Thu)04:32 No. 14451

but everyone loves griffith! or at least used to
he's got a shining city on a hill and doesn't afraid of monsters in the wilderness

nevermind that he's causing the problems half the time, and you know that kind of annoying JFK conspiray quote post? I did some research and found that he wasn't talking about some illuminati conspiracy blah blah blah but rather communist teachers


Historian 14/10/23(Thu)08:40 No. 14452

Relevant link from an economics thread here. Planet Money gives a handy overview of explaining our "Foreign Aid":


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